So says Damian Master, founder of CSR, an underground cassette label in West Michigan. To be honest, I didn't know enough about CSR to even make assumptions. So I reached out to Master and he was gracious enough to talk with me about the business of cassettes.
Isaiah Kallman: I like hearing how people get into cassettes. George Chen started 2,000 Tapes in '09 after getting a lot of 2,000 blanks from a Craigslist ad. Can you give me a brief summary of how you started Colloquial Sound Recordings?
Damian Master: The idea for CSR started around 2006. I knew I wanted to do something like CSR, but I was strapped for time and resources. As a result, I began compiling material and a plan to keep the label sustainable. I didn't want to be a flash in the pan label that goes away after a few releases. I designed it so we could lose money on a handful of releases and keep going. I planned and and planned and waited until the time was right and I could pour myself into the label. There is no story or unique event surrounding the creation of the label. It was just lots of saving, planning, and doing things the right way the first time. That is not to say there haven't been roadblocks, or stumbling periods and a great learning curve, but overall I'm very happy with the direction of CSR. We already have a lot of support coming from very cool people. If there is a label that we model ourselves after it would be a combination of Dischord Records and Hospital Productions. I hold Ian MacKaye, Jeff Nelson, and Dom Fernow in the highest regard. They have created a legacy not only through their music, but through their label, all while producing relevant, uncompromising music.
IK: Let's talk a little about the right way of doing things. I've had a lot of people ask me how cassettes would make any money in the first place. You mentioned preparing for future losses and planning with the label's longevity in mind. When setting the foundation for CSR, what was one of your initial steps?
DM: If people are asking questions about making money, these are generally the type of people you want to give a short, polite answer to and then cut them out of your life. Cassettes are produced by a few people, for a very specific audience. One of the huge benefits is that they are relatively cheap to produce, and can be sold at a low dollar amount with a large profit margin. More than you might see on a CD or LP. Though CDs are quickly becoming so cheap because no one wants them anymore. I don't know about making money. The label supports itself, but I can't explain to someone why in 2012 cassettes are cool. I take that back actually, I've explained it so many times, I don't want to anymore. Cassettes speak to a certain people in a certain way. it's built in. Someone born in 1998 isn't going to feel the same about cassettes as someone who was born in 1988. Although a lot of younger people are fans of cassettes because of the cool sonic properties they possess. Tape compresses things in a really musical way. I actually prefer it over LP for some things. Not all, but some.
One of my initial steps was figuring out how to put out a release 100% independently. Making a website. Building an identity. Doing the graphics. This was all new to me. I did it all. I asked a buddy for some web help and another buddy to design the logo, but beyond that it is all me. My initial step was saving up $1000 in seed money. I knew that the label was going to be a $1000 experiment. I spent the money freely on cassettes (obviously) but also packing supplies, rubber stamps, buttons, etc. Things that make your label real, not just an idea. I also started looking at who my target market might be and started making myself known to them. No shame in that. I started emailing blogs. Not every blog. I posted on forums, not every form, and not in an annoying spammer way... but in a few words, trying to build myself into the community. This isn't to SELL RECORDS, no. Not at all. It's getting into bed with a bunch of like minded people and expressing ideas in the communal setting. Then when the label happened, it was natural. I didn't seem like a salesman. That's the last thing I wanted because I'M NOT THAT WAY AT ALL. To just show up one day and peddle your wares is supremely tacky.
Too many bands, artists, and labels aren't invested in the communities they're a part of. I emailed people. I built relationships. We shared ideas, sources, etc. If you just show up out of no where... that's a sure sign of a phony baloney.
IK: I remember MacKaye telling a story about the Dischord staff dumpster diving at offices so they could use the unused sides of documents. That way, they didn't have to buy copy paper. Does CSR have an interesting way to keep cost down?
DM: Well, we bought some really nice high-end cassette duplicators. We want to take the responsibility on ourselves. I got a pretty good deal on them, but it will not only save us money, but allow us to generate income by offering duplication services to other people. Without going into too much detail (not that anyone will see this who might get mad) I've "overused" some office supplies at my day job to make things happen for CSR. I shamelessly utilize everyone I know who may be of help to me. I do so because there is no shame in it! Most people are excited that they can be a part of something. Another thing I've done to limit my costs is to embrace my limitations. I know life would be a lot easier if I bought a copy of Photshop (I refuse to steal and download the program) but I just use the graphic program (Pages) on my Mac. It forces me to filter what I need through tools. I have to work to create my vision. Also, I have a condenser microphone that acts up. Instead of buying a new one, I figured out how to use it when I mic up the drums so that it wouldn't malfunction. It changes the sound, but that's a good thing. Too many people are interested in things being disposable and replaceable. I can't afford to replace everything when it breaks. It becomes a part of my sound. It becomes a part of the aesthetic. My limitations are only my own. Just with my computer and my interface I have far more processing power than Jimi Hendrix ever had. I know he and the Beatles famously utilized the studio as instrument - I have way more than they did. Am I better? No way. So, I hate it when people want to buy this mic or this pre-amp or this guitar or whatever. Just use what you have. I don't feel like I've stretched the limits of the technology readily available to me. I would use dumpster paper too. No questions asked. If I had that need. I would. I use a lot of recycled items when I write people letters or notes with the orders I pack.
It's all about keeping costs low. That's what keeps the music going. The music will always go actually, but the ability to put it out will fade quickly if you don't DIY or DIT.
IK: For people who don't know (like me), what does DIT mean?
DM: Do it together. I often wish that I had a partner in this. There is Dom and Kris with Hospital, Ian and Jeff with Dischord, Loke and Christian from Posh Isolation. I like the idea of a community working together on something. Why do it yourself when you can do it together? I know the "Y" in DIY often denotes a group of people, but I'd like to see people not involved in the label being supportive. I try and support other good causes myself.
IK: Making a community seems to be just as much a focus for CSR as making tapes. Some underground scenes take pride in their exclusivity, but I didn't get that feel from you. When you announced the creation of CSR's Tumblr, you said, "CSR is not a horde of misanthropic losers, feigning social and environmental isolaiton." And later, "Though we may shy away from social networking - it isn't the social aspect that scares us." You want people to connect, find you guys, find each other. Even simple things like the running line "Do not make assumptions" develop a culture where newcomers want to discover what it means. What was your experience in creating a place for a community to meet and develop?
DM: By nature CSR is very exclusive in the sense that the music, even at it's most fully realized potential, will never sell millions of records. Or even thousands most likely. So, the community that is interested will be small. Since the community is small, and obviously like-minded or at least sharing similar tastes, why not reach out to them? I don't actively promote the label, I rely purely on word of mouth, but yes - I do want people to find us. I enjoy bands that have an air of mystery around them (LLN from France, for example), but these things, while being very cool, are not real. I personally cannot nor do I want to convey myself as something I am not. I have no problems with others doing this. I in fact really like it when others do it. It's just not for me. I want to strike a balance between authenticity and mystery. There are few pictures of CSR bands, no line-ups posted, or album credits, or anything. I enjoy the idea of you filling in the gaps in your own head as to what these bands mean TO YOU. That's where "Do Not Make Assumptions" plays into all this. I want the community to derive meaning from the art for themselves, not to label a band or record as a certain thing. Much of the underground is based on assumption. People think because one person does one thing, they must be into another, or - just because you like this, you believe that. I try not to assume anything about any of the music I listen to. Sometimes artists make it very clear what their intentions are. Frankly - I enjoy music more where the art is presented to you and you reason out what it means to you and apply that reason to you, and you alone. That way the music takes on something totally unique to you because you filtered it through your thought processes, world view, life experiences, etc. I'm hesitant to release something that deals directly with a very clear subject matter. It causes polarization. I prefer communication. Developing this community is an ongoing thing. I now have friends in places on the globe that I've only read about, or seen pictures of. It's wild to think of all the places all over the world our music is being heard and our tapes are being shipped to. It's great. Most of all - social networking is intrusive, tedious, and boring. It's not needed. No one cares what the guys in Dressed In Streams ate for lunch. Social media is mostly obnoxious. I know if CSR had a facebook, we'd connect a lot better with people - but the thought of having to manage that makes my skin crawl. I know no one else involved with CSR will, so that responsibility falls on my shoulders. I shirk it off, 100%. I don't care.
IK: There was a time back in the 90's when people told us records were a waste of money buying an obsolete medium, but it grew on a community. People get regularly classified as "vinyl nerds" now. Do you see a similar future for cassettes in becoming recognized as a legitimate and desirable medium?
DM: No. This will never happen because cassettes were always a stop gap. They were the technological bridge between the limitations of analog technology (LP) and the convenience of digital (CD). They will forever be a fetish item and undesirable to the public, which will make them all the more precious to those who love the format. If I have to explain to someone why a cassette is a great thing, it's not for them. Now, vinyl is HUGE. It accounts for 70% of the sales at the record store I work at. CDs are dying in a big way. I think every medium has it's benefits. If I was putting out a different genre, I'd probably go for a different medium, or maybe no medium at all. Just focus on digital sales. For what we're doing... this is the best. I stand 100% committed to music on the analog format. Print lives. Analog lives. Digital has it's place too, but by nature is easily wiped away.
IK: Can you tell me one thing you're most excited about in CSR?
DM: I'm excited to continue to develop a unique discography. We have great supporters and I always look forward to making new contacts and building relationships.
If you want to connect to Damian at Colloquial Sound Recordings, visit any of the links below.
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